Minister of Justice: Moving around a single value not enough

Minister of Justice Maris Lauri said on the «Otse Postimehest» webcast. Photo: Andres Haabu

A scandal broke out last week when former Estonian female footballer going by the name of Mia Belle Trisna told Kanal 2 current affairs show “Õhtu” that (now former) coach of FC Nõmme Kalju Getulio Aurelio Fredo started sexually mistreating her when she was just 14 years old.

The question of whether age of consent should be raised from the current 14 years in Estonia has resurfaced in the wake of the incident. Minister of Justice Maris Lauri said on the “Otse Postimehest” webcast that the law will be reevaluated, while the matter should be addressed thoroughly and by hurrying slowly so to speak. “We definitely want to do that,” the minister said.

What kind of emotions did the football scandal stir in you?

I was met with a disgusting world reading those interviews. This whole mentality, failure to understand that the young woman is a minor. You are a coach working with children and should not have intimate relationships with any of your customers.

And yet, your first tweet suggested we should try to understand instead of surrendering to prejudice. Do you believe there is anything there that needs further analysis and that should be understood?

I admit it was an unfortunate post. However, it was not aimed at this particular incident but society in general. We need to accept the fact we are all different. But coming to the incident at hand, there is a limit and one needs to know where it is.

It is baffling that while I am currently sharing a studio with a minister who says that it should be crystal clear – in this case for older men – that a sexual relationship with a 14-year-old is unacceptable, the age of consent is still 14 in Estonia. Why is that?

One of the first things people asked me when I became justice minister was why we haven’t raised the age of consent in all these years. I have asked people at the ministry to explain it to me.

And here is that explanation. When Estonia regained its independence in 1991, we returned to legal principles from before World War Two. The principles of the first Republic of Estonia. This clause is from 1918. No one can explain why and how it got there. Politicians failed to reach a consensus on this matter 8-10 years ago.

I have been told that young people supposedly disliked the idea [of raising the age of consent]. That raising the age to 16 years would require Estonia to punish all 14-16-year-olds who are in a sexual relationship.

An age difference clause can be introduced to remedy that problem.

This is true and I do not know why it hasn’t been done.

It seems a little peculiar to suggest young people are against changing the law. Minors have parents or guardians who are responsible for them and are usually not mature enough to make carefully considered long-reaching decisions.

Raising the age of consent would need to be accompanied by a clause to avoid criminalization of sexual relationships between minors. It is a crucial element. I believe that we need a public debate and that young people should be involved.

The Conservative People’s Party (EKRE) presented a bill in February to raise the age of consent from 14 years to 16. You said that the bill includes considerable conflicts as concerns punishments.

The proposal also prescribed new punishments. It turned out that more severe crimes had lower terms of punishment than lighter offenses.  A 22-year-old asking a 17- or 15-year-old out on a date would have carried a tougher punishment than raping that young person.

Is the bill still on the table or was it thrown out for political reasons?

We provided our reasoning and consulted with other ministries, the Police and Border Guard Board, the prosecution and courts. The reason was that some things were out of balance and lacked proper explanation.

I would add another nuance. The fact that young people between the ages of 15 and 18 are allowed to marry under certain circumstances. If we were to raise the age of consent to 16, what about 15-year-olds who are sometimes allowed to marry?

We need to consider all of these nuances. Changing a single value is not enough.

I would add that talk of sex with a 14-year-old being allowed is not accurate. An adult is not allowed to have sexual intercourse or engage in other sexual acts with a person under 18 by taking advantage of the victim’s dependance or by violating influence or trust.

The problem is created when that young person fails to understand what is happening at the time.

That is why our laws include another clause according to which the expiration period for crimes against minors only starts once the victim turns 18.  This means that a person who feels they have been sexually abused as a minor can still take legal action when they are 28.

You said that you believe we are mature enough as a society for raising the age of consent to prove successful. Should political parties simply get their act together and make the change?

It is likely we will have to raise the age of sexual self-determination. But let us not hurry, be smart about it. Or rather let us hurry slowly. This will help us avoid leaving gaps we will not be able to explain later. Every step we take needs to have a reason.

Can you promise as minister that this topic will be kept on the agenda until a solution is found?

That is our intent. Minister of Social Protection Signe Riisalo is very passionate about it and has my support. I believe this matter needs to be solved. It is about more than an amendment. We also need to raise awareness and involve people. Such problems cannot be solved, awful incidents prevented through amendments alone.